There is a story that Jesus tells in Luke 16. Lazarus (the beggar) and the rich man. Some see this as a parable, others, since Jesus uses a name see it as an report by Jesus of something that happened.
In this account (Luke 16:19-31) some specific things are said about what happens right after you die. Here are 4:
1. You are escorted by angels to your destination (more about that later)
2. You are known - the rich man already knew Lazarus, but some how he knows Abraham.
In 1 Cor. 13:12 Paul says we will know even as we are known. So, perhaps that means we will instantly know everyone and they will all know us.
3. We experience sensation - the rich man was in torment, he was thirsty. Not sure how this works but it seems somehow sensations continue.
4. You can't impact the living world from death - the rich man wanted to get a warning back to his brothers even suggesting that Lazarus be sent. But, there was no opportunity to go back.
Granted, Samuel was called back by the medium at Endor, but she was surprised when he showed up, so that might have been a special case. Also, Jesus met with Moses and Elijah at the Mount of Transfiguration but that was certainly a special case as well. One that incidentally confirms the idea that we hold human form and are recognizable after death.
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i have always been curious about the relationship between time and eternity, and have sort of concluded that eternity is very likely something completely different from time going on and on and on... i don't know what that has to do with my question, except that it seems like it might be relevant...
anyway, i would be interested to hear what you think we will be doing "AFTER" we die, and "BEFORE" our bodies are ressurected... will we actually be busy "doing something"?? - i.e. will we get a head start on eternal worship?? - or will we simply "be" in a spiritual state of connectedness and worship with God???...
also... how will that all change after the rapture when our soul is re-united with our body???
This is NOT a response to your posting. It's just a question I have regarding topics I find in the Old Testament.
As I read through some of the Old Testament, I find several things that are disturbing to me. I know that God had a specific purpose for the Israelites during their time of conquest; however, some of the commands given by the LORD seem to be in sharp contrast with the teachings of Jesus. I have friends and family who sometimes challenge me on these "contradictions" and I would like to know how you would address these issues.
As an example, I'm currently reading through Deuteronomy and I came upon Deut 20:10 - 15 which seems to promote slavery and the mistreatment of women and children. I would like to know your response to this particular passage.
Additionally, I know that many other times, God directed the Israelites to destroy "everything that breathes" (sometimes even the animals) and I understand that this was so that they would not "learn the detestable practices" of the nations they were driving out of the land.
I've been attending a class on spiritual warfare in recent months and I'm starting to understand more of the reasons for this kind of annihilation. What are your thoughts about the reasons for the LORD's direction to kill all men, women, children & animals. It seems so barbaric which is in sharp contrast to Jesus' teachings to "Love your enemies" and to "do good to those who mistreat you".
Two answers. First, time and eternity. Specifically what will we do after we die before the resurrection? Actually, a large part of that answer is in this weeks (April 13) message, so stay tuned.
Second, in an unrelated comment, how can a loving God command some of what He commanded in the OT? At about the same time I received this comment, I received an email forwarded from Mart De Haan which addresses a lot of the question. SO...:
"The Bible describes a God whose anger is an important part of His story. From Genesis to Revelation, God expresses not only love but also anger. Moses writes about a time when God was so angry with the children of Israel that He threatened to destroy all of them and start over (DEUTERONOMY 9:8-20). David, the songwriter king of Israel, later wrote that “God is angry with the wicked every day” (PSALM 7:11), and the last book in the Bible pictures a resurrected Lord bringing the wrath of God against a world in rebellion (REVELATION 19:11-16).
The God of both testaments, however, is slow to get angry. He is the opposite of irritable parents whose flash points of anger say more about their own frustration than about their child’s need for correction. The Father in heaven never loses His temper because He has had a bad day or because, in exasperation, He doesn’t know what else to do. Over and over the Bible describes Him as being “ready to pardon, gracious and merciful, slow to anger, abundant in kindness” (NEHEMIAH 9:17; SEE ALSO PSALM 103:8; 145:8; JOEL 2:13; JONAH 4:2; NAHUM 1:3).
The God of the Bible is so patient that He risks being misunderstood. His reluctance to enforce quick justice allows many to conclude that He isn’t watching, or that He doesn’t care (2 PETER 3:3-4). Yet by the time the last pages of the Bible are written, they reveal a God who waits as long as He does to give us time for a change of heart (ROMANS 2:4).
God takes no pleasure in the death of those who reject Him. Many centuries before Jesus’ birth, a Jewish prophet declared that God takes no pleasure in the death of His enemies. Specifically, the prophet Ezekiel declared, “‘As I live,’ says the Lord God, ‘I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?’” (33:11).
Now, as then, God’s heart grieves over the end of those who refuse His offer of pardon and sanctuary.
When Jesus expressed “woes” on His enemies, He was more sad than angry. The “woes” He expressed to those who hated Him were not expressions of angry self-defense. They were expressions of lament, regret, and distress (LUKE 11:42-52).
By “woes” of grief and alarm, Jesus put the Pharisees on notice that they were in danger of being accused and condemned by the very laws in which they took so much pride. So He said to them, “Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you—Moses, in whom you trust” (JOHN 5:45).
God is too loving not to be angry. His anger, slow as it is, remains as evidence that He cares about the harmful things we do to ourselves and to one another.
The opposite of anger is not love. The opposite of anger is to be uninvolved and indifferent. It is because God loves so much that He feels such a mixture of grief and anger toward those who refuse to come to Him—at the expense of themselves and others.
This slow-forming, brokenhearted anger is what finally resulted in the terrible flood of Noah’s day (GENESIS 6:1-6). Later, God’s judgment fell on Sodom and Gomorrah after the sins of the twin cities created conditions of oppression and hard-hearted violence (GENESIS 18:20-21; EZEKIEL 16:49-50). Still later, God’s reluctant anger fell on Jerusalem, who, according to the prophet Ezekiel, fell into such spiritual disgrace that she made Samaria and Sodom look good by comparison (16:51-52).
Nowhere, however, is the heart behind God’s anger better understood than when:
Jesus turned the wrath of the law against Himself. Because of the love that would not allow Him to be uninvolved or indifferent to us, the Son of God took the punishment we deserved (2 CORINTHIANS 5:21). When Jesus said from His cross, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?” (MATTHEW 27:46), that was our hour of judgment. In that moment, our guilt was being punished. God’s anger against all that is evil and harmful in the world was falling on Himself instead of us.
Most amazing is that according to the New Testament, the One who will sit in judgment of the world in the last days is none other than the same Jesus who suffered in our place (MATTHEW 25:31-34; JOHN 5:22-27; ACTS 10:42-43; 17:31; 2 TIMOTHY 4:1).
If this is true, if the anger of God will flash in the eyes of the same One who cried and died for us, then how would we answer a survey that asks how inclined God is to be angry?
Does this sound like a God who is uninvolved or uncaring—or in any way unworthy of our fear, trust, and love?"
i just keep wondering what moses and elijah have been doing while they are wating for the resurrection is all...
do you think maybe they are taking golf lessons from payne stewart??...
o well... i guess i'll hafta wait until sunday to find out...
it was worth the wait for the sunday message... i especially appreciated last sunday's reference to other dimensions...
i heard what you said in the message about the fact that scripture indicates that there will be at least some kind of "sequence of events" in heaven, and so because of that, i have had to re-think my position a bit...
the conclusion (speculation) that i have come to, is that an "eternal dimension" may possibly exist "outside of time", and yet still have some kind of "sequence"... (i realize that this, at first may sound illogical, but since we don't know anything about this dimension, it could certainly have properties that do not conform to our present world >>> right??)
anyway... it seems clear that when a believer dies, his soul somehow leaves this dimension, and goes to be "present with the Lord"... at that point, perhaps there is no longer anything such as "time", and it will be as if we "arrive" in heaven at the same moment as all those who die before us and after us...
in a diagram of this, all of the "known dimensions" (containing everything in existence from the beginning [gen.1:1] to "the end of the book") would be fit into an egg-shaped object (or perhaps a sphere), and THEN when someone dies, they exist simutaneously inside the sphere AND outside the sphere... THEN>>> when eternity ultimately "begins" the sphere ceases to exist...
hahahaha... i guess i better stop... i am even on the verge of making myself laugh now... :)
maybe you should change the title of the series to "what happens when your voice dies"...
ps... no need to publish this comment :)
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